Terrapin Ticketing

A place to discuss anything not covered in the other forums
User avatar
Creedo
Posts: 139
Joined: Mon Jul 27, 2015 4:33 pm

Terrapin Ticketing

Postby Creedo » Thu Oct 12, 2017 7:34 pm

Half of my life, I spent doin' time
for some other fucker's crime

User avatar
patchthenation
Posts: 2659
Joined: Wed Nov 05, 2014 1:12 pm
Location: San Diego, CA

Re: Terrapin Ticketing

Postby patchthenation » Thu Oct 12, 2017 11:34 pm

good lookin guys with a good idea!

User avatar
mok
Posts: 375
Joined: Tue Nov 04, 2014 3:29 pm

Re: Terrapin Ticketing

Postby mok » Thu Oct 12, 2017 11:36 pm

Seems easy to work around? I.e. pay face for the ticket in one transaction and pay a separate service fee not tied to the digital signature...

alilfurther
Posts: 592
Joined: Thu Dec 10, 2015 11:17 am
Location: albany ny

Re: Terrapin Ticketing

Postby alilfurther » Fri Oct 13, 2017 10:33 am

well it seems Madison square garden tickets for dead and co have gone up over a 100.00 from when I looked last skipping this tour

User avatar
rippleish20
Posts: 2941
Joined: Tue Nov 04, 2014 3:13 pm

Re: Terrapin Ticketing

Postby rippleish20 » Fri Oct 13, 2017 11:13 am

The details are pretty important in terms of whether this solves a problem. Not everyone has a smartphone - is the barcode only accessible via your phone? If you can print it you can sell it. Do you have to show the credit card at the venue to tie the ticket to you? This is how a lot of the anti scalping strategies work but is likely to slow access to the venue down. Ticketmaster can already re-issue tickets with new barcodes etc and could enforce the no profit over original cost if they wanted to.

User avatar
Denver Man
Posts: 2776
Joined: Tue Nov 04, 2014 12:03 pm
Location: Colorful Colorado

Re: Terrapin Ticketing

Postby Denver Man » Sat Oct 14, 2017 10:57 am

"If a ticket is bought for more money than the original owner paid for it, the difference is automatically sent to the event creator, preventing scalpers and counterfeiters from making money off fans trying to see their favorite artists."

The event creator (whoever that is) gets the difference? How does that hurt the scalper?

Only legit way of denting scalping is getting rid of secondary market aka stub hubs of the world...
I went walking out last summer
Trying to find a breath of air
I went walking on the mountain
A friend had told me I'd find you there

User avatar
Nycdave
Posts: 2817
Joined: Tue Nov 04, 2014 7:42 pm

Re: Terrapin Ticketing

Postby Nycdave » Sat Oct 14, 2017 6:54 pm

After the original purchase, the only way to stop a ticket from being resold is to insist that the original purchaser show proof that he or she bought the original ticket. Which would mean that once one buys a ticket, U R the only person that can use said ticket. Places like StubHub or anyone else making a profit (aka scalpers) can only exist based on the rules of supply and demand. Once a musician has more people interested in seeing him or her play then tickets to sell, this opens up the door for profit to b made in a secondary market.
This conundrum is not new. Terrapin ticketing gets the problem, but IMHO offers little to nothing by way of a solution. "The internet promised to make buying tickets easier for average people." I'm not sure about that. Was Al Gore aware of this when he invented said internet?
Who is Terrapin tickets anyways? "We are technologists, entrepreneurs, and live music fans that are on a mission to improve the experience that happens before getting into the events we love." Sounds swell, except that these people also see room for profit. "Cryptocurrency technology has proven to be a disruptive force across multiple sectors of the economy with the potential for huge returns for early adopters. If you want to invest in this new application of this technology..."

KayBeSee
Posts: 2
Joined: Mon Oct 16, 2017 8:07 pm

Re: Terrapin Ticketing

Postby KayBeSee » Mon Oct 16, 2017 9:20 pm

Hey everyone, I wrote the Medium post that Creedo posted above. I'm glad to see our project has gotten some feedback on here.

Our goal with Terrapin is not to eliminate tickets that are sold for above face value. Like NYCdave said, this is because of supply and demand. What we are trying to do is instead create a system that changes the structure of the secondary market so that scalpers have no incentive to buy tickets to shows that they have no intention of going to and then resell them to real fans.

We do this in two ways:
1) Make it really, really easy and secure for buyers to buy tickets on the secondary market by letting them post how much money they are willing to spend on tickets and then changing the valid barcode once it is exchanged.
2) Make it so sellers can't profit from selling their tickets.

mok wrote:Seems easy to work around? I.e. pay face for the ticket in one transaction and pay a separate service fee not tied to the digital signature...


We are making it so that buyers and sellers on the secondary market will have no way to communicate with each other before, after, or during a transaction. In fact, they won't even know who they are transacting with since it's all automatic.

I guess someone could go on Facebook or some online forum and solicit their ticket for sale and work out some behind the scenes deal but we think our quicker and more secure platform will win over buyers.

rippleish20 wrote:The details are pretty important in terms of whether this solves a problem. Not everyone has a smartphone - is the barcode only accessible via your phone? If you can print it you can sell it. Do you have to show the credit card at the venue to tie the ticket to you? This is how a lot of the anti scalping strategies work but is likely to slow access to the venue down. Ticketmaster can already re-issue tickets with new barcodes etc and could enforce the no profit over original cost if they wanted to.


You'll be able to print out your tickets. People will still be able to scalp in person but that is still time consuming, requires more effort (physically going down to the venue, waiting outside, etc), and still requires trust. I would think that prices would go down outside a venue too versus online. Yeah, it's not ideal but it's a reality that's unavoidable. Requiring people show a credit card would be a good way to prevent scalping but this isn't really practical for large venues.

Denver Man wrote:The event creator (whoever that is) gets the difference? How does that hurt the scalper?

Only legit way of denting scalping is getting rid of secondary market aka stub hubs of the world...


This is bad wording on my part, sorry about that. By event creator I mean the artist, venue, promoter...basically anyone who helped put the event on. The exact proportions would be decided on a case by case basis I would imagine. The profits could even go to charity if they wanted, it's up to them. This doesn't 'hurt' the scalper so much as it gives them no incentive to buy a ticket in the first place since they can't make money off reselling it.

I think the only legit way to get rid of scalping is to have an unlimited supply which would require a massive, massive venue. Even if there were no stub hubs, people would still scalp.

Nycdave wrote:This conundrum is not new. Terrapin ticketing gets the problem, but IMHO offers little to nothing by way of a solution. "The internet promised to make buying tickets easier for average people." I'm not sure about that. Was Al Gore aware of this when he invented said internet?
Who is Terrapin tickets anyways? "We are technologists, entrepreneurs, and live music fans that are on a mission to improve the experience that happens before getting into the events we love." Sounds swell, except that these people also see room for profit. "Cryptocurrency technology has proven to be a disruptive force across multiple sectors of the economy with the potential for huge returns for early adopters. If you want to invest in this new application of this technology..."


Yeah, the internet probably wasn't invented to make buying concert tickets easier but it did anway and that's why we want to make it better. Right now Terrapin is two 20-something year old software engineers in Cincinnati, OH. We do see room for profit by making this platform. It's a more honest way of doing it than scalping tickets though ;)

User avatar
rippleish20
Posts: 2941
Joined: Tue Nov 04, 2014 3:13 pm

Re: Terrapin Ticketing

Postby rippleish20 » Tue Oct 17, 2017 11:47 am

I guess I need more specifics before determining if any of this changes anything

1. If someone can print the barcodes then the ticket could be resold. You could print to PDF and transfer electronically or stand outside the venue and sell the printed barcode. How does your system prevent this?

2. A safe resale platform already exists. Ticketmaster can transfer your tickets and re-issue a new ticket and barcode. If the buyer can only "sell" a ticket by pushing it back int the market via this system and has no control over who buys it, and the extra money goes to the artist then might be an improvement, but is this how your system works?

3. Promoters and venues can still siphon off tickets for resale. And they can still play games with VIP and "marketing"


I am dubious anything other than requiring the original buyer to show ID at the venue solves anything. The minute you start relying on bardcodes etc there are always ways of transferring them....

User avatar
Nycdave
Posts: 2817
Joined: Tue Nov 04, 2014 7:42 pm

Re: Terrapin Ticketing

Postby Nycdave » Tue Oct 17, 2017 1:24 pm

KayBeSee wrote:We do see room for profit by making this platform. It's a more honest way of doing it than scalping tickets though ;)

I have no problem with anyone creating a platform and making money through the use of said platform. Obviously reselling tickets at a profit (even a small profit) is what scalpers do. I'm confused why running this resale system through "Terrapin tickets" would be any more (or less) honest then selling / scoring ducats through either ticket stub or a man in a raincoat & sunglasses.


Return to “General Discussion”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: dr bakes and 3 guests